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Over-colonization is a term that we've heard now, what does it mean to you?

I had actually not heard that term and I was taking a workshop in the Pacific, called the Pacific Basin Consortium. It was a 15 day workshop and it was in Hawaii. In Hawaii, a lot of their teachers are Japanese American or Chinese American, a lot, probably the majority of them. It was like all the ones from Hawaii, practically, were, maybe 90% of the people in that workshop. It was the first time in my life, I consider myself on the shy side, but compared to my colleagues at Marin Country Day. But I have always considered myself that and what happened was that I had evolved in my ability to be comfortable and to be myself and to say what I needed to say, and to stand up for myself. All these good things you learn.

So I was in this workshop, and I would sit there, and I would be asking questions and I would be saying things. I realized that I was really talkative, because this stuff would come up, and I would either reply or I would want to know. It's normal conversation, at Urban School I'd be shy, I'm sure. We were in little groups and this guy, he was Japanese American or Asian American, and he was the leader of the group. I was kind of silly, and I sort of said something that I realized that he could construe as rude, I said, "Get on with it!", or whispered that to him, because I felt like he was dragging on and on, and it was hot. I apologized to him later, I said, "I'm sorry that I said that, because I think it made people laugh." I delivered a proper apology, and he said, "Oh, think nothing of it. I know you've been over-colonized." And then I realized that from his point of view, I was too "mainland", from a Hawaiian point of view, that my identity was more like a mainland person, and they talked more. As a woman, I was much more outgoing than the women, who were my age and younger, really, they have a different demeanor. I came out of Berkeley, what can I say?

What was the tone? Was it scornful?

It was a little bit, it was a little, blowing me off. I could still talk to him, I didn't get angry, but it was definitely, "What can you expect? You're over-colonized, you're from the mainland."

That was very different from what your parents were like?

Yeah, very contained. In fact, one of the things my mother would say to me, even when I was in high school, when I was nice and shy, more shy, she said, "Janet, all your emotions are showing on your face! Clam up!" That was not a good thing for a Japanese girl to manifest, to show my emotions. Even then, and I've only gotten worse, over time. I can have a tantrum like those five year olds. No, not really. But that was not an acceptable value, that was not a norm. I apparently would not make it in Hawaii, either.

What about your brother?

I think for males, it's OK. It's like, he was quite the guy. He channeled that into athleticism, and it was just fine that he was the sassy one; he was the naughty one. He said what he thought, he still does, but it isn't the same. It is the double standard. He didn't get in trouble the way that I would have, had I done that. I think that teachers work really hard nowadays, to try to equalize the energy that they're giving boys and girls, but that's a fairly new thing, the last, maybe 15 years, where we were even aware that we were giving boys more or expected girls to be good little girls, and not be so spunky. But I think we have grown, as educators in that way.

If there was just one thing that you could say, to younger children, Japanese American younger children, or the broader [range] of children, what would it be about your experience?

My wish is that children, all children could be educated to know themselves, to listen to what they need to do, to understand their value, to themselves and to their community, and to have the courage to do what they want to do and be who they want to be. I think to live from the inside out is more powerful, and allows you to feel your power but it also allows you as an authentic being, to relate to the outside, and to do what you need to and hopefully, if everybody's working from the inside out, from a place where they feel right, that it will be a better society. It's a dream.

Do you feel like it's a big part of your life still? Is it just your close friends who know about the internment?

No, wherever they've asked me to do it, or speak about it, I do it, because I feel like that's my job, it's part of who I am, it's part of the experience. Of course you tell that, so you're hoping that the other generations will have a better sense of being socially just, of justice, and of an evolution of being a human being, because you tell the story. I think we have to do it, to remind people that this I am a human being, and that you are a human being, and that we're all in this together. How we manifest our humaness is important to all of us, and that hopefully we're going to evolve. I said, it's a dream, that we will be better people, because you heard a story or you heard something and that you make a singular decision when you need to, to do what's right, to do what your center knows is right, and you have the courage to do that in the face of opposition or people who don't agree with you. It's a big task.

What about people that you are just meeting? Is it something that you share immediately?

No, I wouldn't do that. If it came up in the normal course of conversation, or when I knew somebody better, but it's not something that I feel particularly that I want to put in somebody's face. It's not all of who I am, it's one part of my experience. But there are more important things, like how I'm living right now, and how I'm communicating with you, or how I accept you, or the relationships that I'm in, in present time, are more important. The past, you need to speak about if you're asked, or if it can educate somebody. I think your project is an incredible project. I came with great resistance.

Why did you come with resistance?

Because I am not by nature an extrovert, but there is a part of me that is a teacher, and can contain passion for who I am and what I'm trying to communicate. I know that I can do that. The resistance is, "What? Drive to the city and find a parking space? I'll die, on the way!" It's more the resistance of logistics. But now I can speak through these things without the kind of pain that it used to when I first started doing it because I didn't know what would come up. Now—especially in this project—I feel like I can say what I need to say, but it's not painful to do it anymore. I think for a lot of those other people, they haven't gone there because it wasn't right for that generation. I stood up in front of people and screamed once, and it was good. Too bad that people had to hear me. But I've had people cry with me in that setting who weren't Japanese American, just who were human beings. And that, for me, was a healing moment that other people actually do feel, they can feel for you, and that made me feel like we were in this pot called being a human being together.